mountain lions in new hampshire

I mean that so many of them are false sightings we. I'm gonna send you a letter that we researched this report and we spoke with those labs and the lab wrote in their letter to us that they could only say that Scott contained white Tea Party fur and that they could not say what deposited the scout because it's far too degraded listeners we'd love to hear from you about your mountain lion sightings if you have seen one or if you if you think you have give us a call we'd love to hear your story 1 800 8 9 2 6 4 7 7. There have been several sightings of mountain lions in New Hampshire recently. They're the generalists that made it through both the arrival of the Clovis people with their with their spears and then the Europeans with their guns. Caller: It had just left that field and was out. Less successful males roam further. Women control our lives. Can you look into this picture. Give today. Support for an age PR comes from you our listeners. Join as a $8 per month sustainer and get our brand-new owl umbrella! Early in the morning. I don't know if she still is. And as the biologist who's gonna stand on this and if I'm going to say this is a proven picture I need to be able to stand on it so soundly and have the evidence so I going to go through it with a fine tooth comb kept picking pieces apart trying to answer these pieces. If you missed part of today's program listen to the exchange. Absolutely there are a lot of folks out there who for some reason need to create something that raises a stir and gets the attention of the media etc.. As recently as 2011 there was one young male mountain lion that cruised all the way from the black hills of South Dakota, up over the Great Lakes, down through New Yorkgetting spotted all along the waykilled a beaver near the Quabbin Reservoir in Central Massachusetts, left behind prints and DNA at that site, and then was hit by a car in Connecticut. These were normal everyday folks. But if you were to get Western dispersing mountain lions just would just sort of expanding into New Hampshire. Can we go to the site. Using DNA and physical evidence, state environmental officials said they determined that the animal. And to anyone listening I would just say you know fishing game who wants proof right. Caller: Well I think Patrick I recognized your name. And I was probably about a half a mile from downtown all village on the right. Right. So take care of this problem. 19 I wasn't employed as biologists at the time of a situation that's been reported but so I started digging into this report and spoke with another wildlife biologist with the agency and said Do you know anything about this. I hope she's listening and she had spoke to a lot of different people ended up having a couple of sightings of her alone without sort of by accident. Sam Evans-Brown: What he would have stopped as well I think is way way that the reason that mountain lion kept moving is because he wasn't finding anybody. 235 or nhandy@ledgertranscript.com. On Oct. 10, he gave a slide talk called "Wild Cats of New Hampshire," which included the bobcat and the lynx. 50 feet above the most. Peter Biello: Ok weird question but do they make good pets. Peter Biello: Yeah well what do you think Pat is. The females disperse a shorter range and once they find a vacant home range they stay in that location and live there. We had six copies printed out each. And the cougar embodies that. I'm Peter B yellow. But are there mountain lions living in New Hampshire? BUT THAT SAID, Id love to be proven wrong. You could trace that was this same cat from point to point to point. Patrick Tate: Yeah yeah. for some excitement. And there's there's no evidence of that cat's movement in that entire you know 12 hundred miles stretch of its journey. The report came in from a conservation officer. We mentioned that one cat that was hit by a car where it has it that it was a male looking for me. But if you do if you think you're looking at a wild Puma their tail is very thick and especially in the winter is very thick and ponderous looking. I mean there was this one lady I remember and tough tomorrow. Are there Mountain Lions in NH? Can you tell us about that story. Pat do they typically just move around a lot. 10 things to do in NH this weekend: Dartmouth Dance, Hamilton De Holanda & more, Turkish restaurant in the Upper Valley aims to help those affected by recent earthquakes, RFK Jr. tells NH crowd hes considering a presidential run, Epping woman pleads guilty to threatening Michigan election official in 2020. Think you've seen a mountain lion. So one thing I'll add we're talking about natural dispensers but talking with the conservation officer in the 1980s they recall going to a residence telling a person you can live here but your mountain lion can't. OK. Rick van de Poll: Rick and I would add that if a mountain lion male takes up residence and successfully finds a female as pets there's gonna be a lot more evidence there will be like deer carcasses up in trees and territorial marking and claw marks and tracks and it you know dispersal is gonna be very tough to see or observed but residential parrots a totally different story. Something along those lines. Mike you're on the air. Caller: Yeah I hadn't experienced blastoff fall so this was around September and I was driving from Webster into Concord on Horse Hill Road and anybody in the area would know I was right near the Red Barn and all of a sudden this animal jumps out of the woods and it bounded across the road in about two two giant leaps and stopped in the field just on the other side. And it's not really strong. Incredible sighting and I called him the fish and game and they immediately sent me to a website to look at all the bobcat pictures. Peter Biello: What about the idea of tourism like us leaving aside the fact that it is not on the Endangered Species Act is it. Yeah 13 to 15 years ago 13 to 15 years ago. I think that you probably are. I think as Pat was saying you know 35 to 50 pounds on a male be reasonable range whereas mountain lions you're up to 100 110 maybe even 130 pounds on a big male. Enable JavaScript by changing your browser options, and then try again. Peter Biello: Yeah. Thanks for your call. Mountain lions when they show up they leave evidence. It's not an emerging endangered species no work no there are there are populations in specific states so the Florida panther is is an endangered species that sub population is in fact listed under the Endangered Species Act. Thanks for taking my call. We'd love to have you in the queue. So Marty can you see what I'm getting at is the public sees different names and thinks that they're different animals but it's all the same animal. The way that we define species has undergone a revolution with the advent of DNA testing. We we hear that there is allegedly a government conspiracy to deny the existence of mountain lions here in New Hampshire so I guess a local government conspiracy. So when we hear mountain lion there's also cougar there's wild cat there's Bobcat which is not a mountain lion maybe Patrick could you sort of spell out the different terms which are synonymous and which are completely different animals. They're just moving around freely. I've actually had to walk in on one or two now and look at what was going on and figured out what was going on. Oh you saw him online. Which which I think Pat and I have both experienced. And why would they what. Listeners give us a call if you'd like. Patrick Tate: Martin Like what about Panther Panther saying animals same animal and like a bit of trivia Guinness Book of World Records says the animal with the most names is in English alone they're supposedly 40 names for Mount lion. You know I think it's there's a lady Holly Ernst out in California who has done a lot of the genotyping of mountain lions in Northern California the ones that are of course most people have heard about taking down hikers bikers etc. But having read a bit of information about his cougar there are a darker subspecies. Mike Guyton pressure was almost Greyhound like very muscular large back legs on it and the coloration on it was almost an orange brownish orange color and so I stop and I look at this thing in the field and as the animal looks at me the face was very chiseled definitely not a bobcat. Mountain Lions in New Hampshire-Fact or Fiction. And just one more note about this danger question when even when you look at the states that have extended populations stable populations of mountain lions attacks are relatively rare. Peter Biello: Ok. The current estimate is 2,000 - 2,700 throughout Arizona. Sam what's the incentive for the government to deny allegedly. Patrick Tate: Yes. We have evidence and as biologists we would find it quite exciting to find that evidence of one in the state. It all used to be based on measurable physical traits color, skull size, paw size, etc but now its based on whether an animal can be shown to be genetically distinct from others. And when provoked no animal could stand before him elegantly put. And they were using all the habitat. Yes. So I just brought up the bobcat thing because the location is fascinating to me that that that location we have Bobcats existing but that location we have a mountain lion report because it's a developed area and which brings me back to earlier what I had said it's a bouncing ball. Some of the reports that I looked into that were actually on file at the local fish and game office were even from people who did not live locally. And maybe it's a no holds barred nostalgia for a better world a wild or Fuller world not a world that's constrained by our boundaries and our taxes and our highways. Erler is a senior naturalist at the Squam Lakes Natural Science Center in Holderness. The states never denied mountain lions are here, and theyve never admitted mountain lions are here. Patrick Tate: It's wow interesting that you brought this up because I've had people report I saw cardamom. Each person had their own copy and now it was identify the trees the species of tree matched. Anyways after three weeks I finally found the image on line on a field and stream photo contest and the explanation in the end was the person that set the camera out with another individual and they believed that someone who knew of the camera location saw the similarities put the can't picture on their SD card so it looked like that camera recorded the image that is. The big cat has been extinct at least the eastern mountain lion has been extinct here since the mid 80s hundreds. The trouble with accepting every reported sighting as a confirmed mountain lion is that there are so many mistaken identifications. The American Lion The Saber tooth Tiger and this was the one that survived. So the whole media hype about how scary mountain lions are should should go away immediately and that would be that I think the major thrust of educating folks about these casualties vs.. Sam Evans-Brown: Sam go ahead. If you believe you have seen a mountain lion and want to report it to NH Fish and Game, please contact the Wildlife Division at (603) 271-2461 or wildlife@wildlife.nh.gov to request an observation report form. Let us know your story and share your photos! If you go on YouTube and search mount lion Pat you can see people patent their hundred pound kiddie like its regular mascot cat. In my New Hampshire career I have written several, and seen at least 20, stories along the lines of "local person thinks they saw a mountain lion but there's no actual evidence aside from. Contact the Wildlife Division at (603) 271-2461 or wildlife@wildlife.nh.gov to request an observation report form. Theres a project called the Cougar Network that tracks verified sightings, and they are all around us: Massachusetts, Connecticut, Maine, New York and New Brunswick have all had verified sightings over the past 20 years or so. They create these big latrines that are very obvious. The views expressed in this program are those of the individuals and not those of an HP are its board of trustees or its underwriters. But before I go any further I want to say we do not have sufficient game. Peter Biello: Well Mike thanks very much for sharing your story. Well thanks for sharing. And today we're talking about the mysterious elusive mountain line with folks who know something about it. Here she is talking about how to identify a mountain lion. They used to roam the entire continent, but have become extinct in most US states. And so so with their limited staff and limited budget that is that is more and more limited every year because you know fewer people are buying hunting and fishing licenses. Your support makes this news available to everyone. Share. So I did a bunch of research and all the documentation I found was there art are not any pieces of DNA of Eastern online. So so it is possible in Maine to still to to to have one but you have to be sort of professional handler as it were. So here we have you know a very qualified biologist who who found a print took a plaster cast found a scat send it to a university. It's not a skinny rope like tail like a housecat. We'll be right back. Somewhere the way they travel the things they do they're going to leave evidence. In fact, Pat Tate concedes that hes been told of sightings from folks that he considers to be very credible, very woods savvypeople who know what a bobcat looks likebut those folks have never snapped a good photo or found a good track. She was having a garden party on her back porch and everybody in the party saw this mountain lion across the field down below the porch. Peter Biello: This is the exchange on an PR. I've seen him in the woods and that was not a bobcat but I was looking at. Deer Bear Moose Grey Wolf Coyote Foxes Fisher Mountain Lion NH Wildlife History. Caller: So I've been telling this story for five years or so and very few people believe me. What do you think that. The Lions of New Hampshire: MD44 Links. (Cue the X-Files music: The Government is denying the cougars exist!) This decision was primarily for nerdy phylogeny reasons, though, because the eastern cougar probably never existed. And Rick van de Poll naturalist and founder of ecosystem management consultants of New England. One was in Shelton. Infinite Scroll Enabled. About Lions. Peter Biello: Mm hmm. And because you know things flow downhill and I was pushed to go investigate it more and met with the individual two or three times and there was a bunch of inconsistencies about the photograph. If it's someone that has an illegal captive animal that is accustomed to humans those leave a lot of evidence because they want to go around humans to find food meaning they're used to being fed by humans. We send out DNA samples to the U.S. Forest Service Rocky Mountain Research Station. Author of The last woman in the forest on Saturday July 13th at 7 p.m. at Warner town hall Warner historical dawg. Administrative Links. Peter Biello: Well John thanks very much for the story really appreciate it. Peter Biello: Well yeah. The brother and sister big cats have lived . Patrick Tate: So I just got to throw a little interesting side note in this. So it's there was no question in my mind. Rick van de Poll: Well the mountain lion of course has been sort of an enigma in the wildlife suite for years and years. I believe I saw one that's fine and I'm not looking for an immediate story. Over a period of a year and a half, this Mountain Lion left DNA evidence in at least four states. I mean so what what is the practical change that it would bring to New Hampshire if any. So one thing I'll add. Well let me ask maybe Pat and Rick about this. There were several sightings in CT over the last few months. Tim Yeah. These young males are tracking looking for mates and if they don't find a mate they just keep moving and moving and moving. Reviewing the evidence, the U.S. Patrick Tate: So I'm not sure what subspecies of cat they're using to differentiate by those markings but once she was describing the White other face in the black. Me Im willing to believe its possible that there are some out there. They sent it already. brings a lot of. So nowadays we think of this in the Northeast as crazy stuff that people have a mountain lion as a pet. So give us a call now. But also I think it proves the opposite point which is that sometimes they're pretty secretive because all the way from Minnesota where the where was the first time was picked up on a game camera to New York. A monthly donation of $5 makes a real difference. Tonight, Sean McDonald investigates,. We are the second most-forested state in the country, and those forests can be impenetrable snarls (part of why the Northeast is notoriously a difficult place to hunt deer), and while there are people in a lot of those woods, because the cats have been absent for a few generations now, most of those people dont know what a cougar scrape or latrine look and smell like. It was really muscular looking cat I mean is that like a side angle to me. You know I'm like seriously I can't get a picture of the thing but what it what it is. So I certainly can't dispute anything that they said there's no evidence for me to go by to verify or say what my thoughts are on the situation. We'll also hear your stories if you have them again. Think you've seen a mountain lion? Or years or so. As wildlife biologists, wed be fascinated to say 'look look what was found in our state.'. And so I just wanted to share my share my experience with you guys and it was pretty awesome to see if you get to see one albeit it was in the brush. So this whole illegal pet trade black market pro trade thing does does exist in a situation like that can happen. The term is because mascots notwithstanding right that they're referred to with a lot of different terms and sometimes they can be confused with a lot of different terms. And there are thousands of mountain lions killed every year legally through hunting, and there have been untold tens of thousands of mountain lions killed by hunters over the last hundred years, says Mark Elbroch, the Puma Program Director for Panthera, a global wild cat conservation organization, So even the folks who live with mountain lions still have a fancy and see something thats not there to me thats incredible.. What gets confusing is when you have a large adult animal and a smaller juvenile animal of a different species you can now step start beginning talking about overlapping body weights and sizes. Sue Morse: First and foremost if you have color or if you could see details of color look at the front of the face around the Pumas muzzle the muzzle itself is pure white. So we're fixated on natural but there's other possibilities. Good morning guys. Email exchange it an HP fraud org or give us a call 1 800 8 9 2 6 4 7 7. It's listed as population of least concern. Patrick Tate: I would say well when social media first started they picked up the hoaxes became much more prevalent in the last four or five years hoaxes have died down completely. It doesn't happen as much anymore. But you won't find evidence of their existence in paw prints in the snow or a deer carcass in a tree. 1 800 8 9 2 6 4 7 7. Peter Biello: They make great mascots at least. It traveled all the way from from you know Minnesota to New York without being so seen Patrick take. 8 9 2 6 4 7 7. So there's even debate about that very subject. The western mountain lion lives in a more of a grassland open area now so to blend in with a very lighted situation here in the Northeast we are very shadowy dark situation because of the forest and our cats wear a darker brownish reddish color than what they were and they were also smaller than what the western mountain lion is. We'd be inundated with scouts in the past when newspaper articles have been written about DNA and scouts. However if if and when it does happen it takes up a lot of resources looking at that situation and identifying what's going on because when you start out you don't know it's a hoax. Mountain lions don't usually travel more than 100 miles from where they are born. The engineers Dan Colgan our senior producer is Allan Grimm. Chartered 1973; Member of District 44-H; . Sam Evans-Brown: Well this might be a good moment to talk about hoaxes. Thank you very much for being here. I have no doubt that there are mountain lion roaming New Hampshire. N.H.'s Fish and Game department says there's no proof. So Michael follows with the question. 44-N Links. If it's just in the middle of a greenfield you can't prove anything. Sam Evans-Brown: Well first I want to sort of explain why what the theory is but then also throw a bit of cold water on it because I don't think there's much much logic behind it but essentially is that if fish and game were to acknowledge that there was a population of Mount lions in the state there's a chance that something like a listing under the federal Endangered Species Act might happen and then there'd be you know some they'd have to put a plan in place to protect the species there'd be you know restrictions put on development. Really appreciate it. Ecosystem Management Consultants of New England, Ask Sam, and recently fielded question about mountain lions, 10 things to do in NH this weekend: Dartmouth Dance, Hamilton De Holanda & more, Turkish restaurant in the Upper Valley aims to help those affected by recent earthquakes, RFK Jr. tells NH crowd hes considering a presidential run, Epping woman pleads guilty to threatening Michigan election official in 2020, We also hear excerpts from an interview with, Read about the most recent cougar "sightings". Peter Biello: Hmm. Have you heard stories do you have questions about the mountain line. Rick van de Poll: 80 90. So. Really appreciate it. We'll hear from her periodically through the show. Caller: Oh hi. So so do what you can get to do what you can to get proof. So you know until I found those two scats I didn't think that mountain lions were here in the east. So that that's more or less I think why I'm here and why I got into this in nineteen ninety nine I found a what appeared to be a print of a mountain lion and that was in the Osprey mountains and I thought well OK that's that's a print. You know interactions are pretty unusual. Well within there. Peter Biello: From New Hampshire Public Radio I'm Peter Biello in for Lark Knoy and this is the exchange. Pat ruse and he was sampling doing DNA samples from cats in the Upper Peninsula of Michigan. Right. If you have them email exchange at an HP board or give us a call to tell us your story. But if people are still seeing mountain lions, why is the state and federal government seeking to COVER IT UP!? So. Nicholas Handy can be reached at 924-7172 ext. I noticed it had a really big sweeping tail that kind of curled up behind it and all but still at that point because everyone says there's no mountain lions here. They were able to do all that by genetics. I live pretty much on the town line of Greenfield just a couple of miles down in the Greenfield. Are these big cats back?Subscribe to WMUR on YouTube now for more: http://bit.ly/1lOjX9CGet more Manchester news: http://wmur.comLike us: http://facebook.com. So Pat you field a lot of calls about people seeing or reportedly seeing mountain lions. There was no sign of it. Sam Evans-Brown: I just want to say the bang and word you just heard I think to me exemplifies why it's really hard to come up with with positive you know 100 percent certain evidence that you've that what you've got is a mountain lions. He writes As a farmer I come across many outdoorsman looking to hunt our property had a conversation with one who believed very strongly that we had mountain lions in New Hampshire. How to Report a Possible Mountain Lion Sighting. Peter Biello: There have been several alleged sightings of mountain lions in New Hampshire recently. NH Fish and Game relies on physical evidence to answer questions about the presence or absence of mountain lion in the state. From "History of New Hampshire Game and Furbearers" by Helenette Silver, Research Clerk, NH Fish and Game Dept. WMUR NH Chronicle Mountain Lions in NH Part I and Part II. M from Tree Hill author series presenting Diane lay back. So I hate the idea that there's some sort of upward you know downward pressure from the bosses saying Don't you know don't tell about the mountain lions because it'll scare away the tourists. I had a resident in New Hampshire tell me a story of a mountain lion in the 1960s where a person who would come summer in New Hampshire and then live in a different part of the country in the winter had a trailer that was housing his mount line. Course like Sue said you have to see it and it's not always that visible. List of Mountains in New Hampshire is a general list of mountains in New Hampshire, with elevation.This list includes many mountains in the White Mountains range that covers about a quarter of the state, as well as mountains outside of that range.. Ive received pictures of dogs at odd angles, says Tate. And a lot of people around the county airport have seen a lot of pilots coming in said they saw huge. This is a machine-generated transcript, and may contain errors. That's what we're seeing is dispersing mountain lions from the West who are just making their way through. That's the real story is they can't follow up on every one of these sightings. Some are included in lists of mountains, such as the Appalachian Mountain Club (AMC) list of the Hundred Highest peaks of New England, or the . About Us Media Kit Calendar of Events Volunteer Visit Learn Events Membership Support Your Visit BUY TICKETS Know Before You Go Directions and Information Our Animals Live Animal Exhibit Trail Hours and Admission Calendar of Events I just saw the head and the tail that was leaving. But along the lines of the conspiracy theories as you mentioned earlier there there was a bit of a sense on behalf of what I'll call the promo online community who felt that fishing gain maybe not even so much in a spoken policy but maybe sort of an unspoken policy did not want to find themselves in a situation where they had to spend money to create a management plan and so forth. Thank you. Are there other powers that be worried that scary mountain lions will scare off people from camping in New Hampshire. This is where things start breaking down when you so I get pictures with this great description and one of my favorite stories is a great description what the witness and then so I called the witness and wanted information from them and the person says What are you talking about. And we want to know your stories if you have them 1 800 8 9 2 6 4 7 7 or email exchange at an HP bar dot org we'll talk about conspiracy theories when we come back. Thanks also to Rick van de Poll naturalist and founder of ecosystem management consultants of New England and Sam Evans Brown host of an HP podcast outside in about the natural world and how we use it. Wed love to be part of the first verified sighting. So I don't understand really how how this this idea came to be but it is the main reason why folks believe that fishing game is is covering up the fact that there are mountain lions in the state again with no evidence. I mean no doubt a seen Bobcat seen his stuff. As far as I could tell there was a positive DNA sequence coming from the scat sample Patrick. Do you want to see real, living mountain lions that do exist in New Hampshire. So you want identifiable backgrounds. It doesn't make much sense because you know mountain lions are as we as we said before. I tracked cats and all the western states. I saw that had this giant the bobcat had this giant sweeping which is John Bobcat don't have big sweeping tails. Select image for larger view. But you can continue the conversation on Facebook or at our Web site and HP Borg. GAP MOUNTAIN LIONS CLUB Fitzwilliam, New Hampshire (USA) District 44-N . "Of those three to five reports,. Mountain Lions in New Hampshire-Fact or Fiction 3,207 views Jul 31, 2019 78 Dislike Share Save New Hampshire Fish and Wildlife 634 subscribers During my thirty-one career at the New. HOLDERNESS, N.H. (AP) Two of the known mountain lions in New Hampshire have spent their 15 years in close proximity to humans. Lions Clubs Int'l Links: LionNet NH Links 2011 -2012 . Peter Biello: We got an e-mail question from Robert in Epsom who asks are sightings or encounters with these big cats less dangerous here where they're passing through than out west where those same mountain lines might be establishing territory Rick. Peter Biello: But clearly you know you're saying like hoaxes people who claim to have seen a mountain lion but knowingly have not or are appropriating photos taken elsewhere of legit mountain lion say out West where they people acknowledge that they exist certainly knowingly or unknowingly in this case the person who sent it to me said hey a friend of mine sent me this photo and said he took it on his back porch also. The supervisor that hired me in the game division in October of 1978 passed on to me this whole big folder of mountain lion information and sightings going back probably a couple decades. Absolutely. Chapter X, Predators, Panther (Mountain Lion) From History of NH Game and Furbearers by Helenette Silver, Research Clerk, NH Fish and Game Dept. Sam Evans-Brown: Well and I think and the last takeaway here is everyone I think probably agrees that any possible sightings that have been seen. So hard to know hard to refute if there's no interest in making up a story which many people of course do then I would respond the same way as Pat did.